Hi to Arlene Janner! I'm going to try your Dropbox link another day, as your account has been suspended for too much traffic. Like a lot of others, I don't download from 4 Shared (or Mediafire, for that matter). Have you thought about a free account at another file sharing site? I personally have (paid) accounts at Dropbox, Google Drive and Jumpshare, and you can start off with free accounts at the last two as well. There are other sites, too. Just an idea!
Julie and Erin, excellent points! I agree wholeheartedly! Thank you for all your hard work, I truly do appreciate it! So far, there hasn't been anything I was offended by in any of the kits. And if there ever would be, I might bring it up in the working thread, or, if I feel that strongly about it, I could just design my OWN kit without the offensive to me items. Absolutely----if there is anything I don't like in anyone's kit, I don't have to download it, or use it! Very simple.
Good point, Lisel "if there is anything I don't like in anyone's kit, I don't have to download it, or use it"
I know that the first thing I do when I've downloaded all the kits is to go through all the folders, and delete items that don't appeal to me personally, or that I know I'll never use. And, it's a great idea to check out the designer previews in the working thread, and raise questions there, rather than in the comments on the final list. I would never question Varia's beliefs (or anyone else's), or their right to raise them on this site, but I do feel that the working thread would be the best place to make a comment, because the item in question could be removed from the kit before the blog train even starts.
Great idea about the working thread Thank you!, I'm still new to PS and right now have limited pc time, but will check it out. For the record I am not and never was "offended" I was never talking about the element in the kit! I was trying to share that the phrase it's self is toxic in the world at large. (why I provided a link) I'm an activist plain and simple, always have been always will be. In my personal life (unlike my profile pic I am 44 years old), I have seen those words "boys will be boys" lead directly to rape. It's a mindset that violence is OK because of a body part and that is wrong to me and many, many others. Thank you to those who are open to people sharing their opinions, this is how we will move forward as a people. We are all one after all. Peace.
Varia, I agree, that phrase has definitely been inappropriately used, and to excuse horrible behavior. It's sad to me that a phrase like this---which used to bring to mind a nostalgic childhood full of muddy knees from playing in the dirt or wrestling with their buddies, ripped jeans from climbing trees, or tinkering with cars or old radios and getting oil all over themselves---is being used to excuse absolutely despicable and abhorrent choices. Hopefully, as we all learn from each other and grow more aware of how things are misused we can bring positive change together.
OH Lisel I do agree, it was such a cute and nostalgic phrase and it is sad!!! Thank you for understanding. I wish your beautiful descriptions were the only thing those words meant.
Susannah, Thank you so much for sharing. I am so sorry that you were assaulted. HUGE gentle hugs. I too love all the communication that came about! YAY!! I continue the peace and health blessings for all in 2017!!
I don't have any hard feelings for people saying what they believe, however, I don't think it' a good idea to for us to start censoring the creative people who have been so kind to make and give away their art. I'm all for people talking about what they would like to see in a blog train, but I don't like the idea of telling someone what their art shouldn't be. I'm very sorry for those who have had bad experiences concerning words and phrases used in the wrong way. I think maybe the time to speak up would be in those particular instances to inform those saying "boys will be boys" to excuse bad behavior is to point out to them that bad behavior has no gender. Take back the true meaning of "boys will be boys" with their muddy knees and dirty faces!
@Anna Johnson: When it comes to word art that isn't really appropriate to me, I look for a way to twist it--maybe a marker font in a contrasting color to make it say "TOMBoys will be TOMboys"... just a thought. I might do a lot of art these days, but I knew the name of every tool in my dad's shop when I was 3 and could go get him an 8" gear puller or a 9/16" box-end offset wrench as long as he was specific about what he wanted. In fact, one of the things I requested for my birthday this year was a Skilsaw, as I have a quick rebuild in mind to recover some floor space in my bedroom/studio and still be able to use the window light...
Wow! What a fun blog-train. I love all of the different takes on the theme. OMG OklahomaDawn, your kit is so cute. I love the banner. You are getting so good at designing. Thank you to all of you. xoxox Beth
“Not wishing to start controversy, but a couple of people have raised the gender issue, and I really think this inappropriate.”
I would have loved to have known about the working thread when it existed. Also, I’m not shaming designers. This (as in the notion that only men can be masculine tool-users who make things, fix things and so on) is just something I’m kinda tired of seeing in not just one store, and because of my personal life it’s not really represented at all save the few packs that I see around are named things that are non-gender-specific like “nuts and bolts” (which I instantly buy, to the detriment of my bank account. Also: machining blueprints are also something I will instantly purchase too if I see it. I can never get enough of those, hence my singing praises earlier in the thread at Elizabeth? who provided them in the blog train).
Quote:
“The title of the blogtrain was, quite clearly,"The Guys" .. which certainly implies it is male oriented. If there is word art in kits that is inappropriate for me,i.e. "mom" instead of "mum", I simply make my own titles.”
An alternate spelling of a title/identity isn’t really the same thing as what I’m describing (as what I’m describing isn’t a tweak but a whole shift on how one perceives culture and society with patriarchal gender norms). I don’t really need to be over-explained on the fact that this is called “the guys”. Last I heard, males didn’t have a monopoly on owning tools, or being the only gender who can use tools. So, it’s really kinda weird for people to describe something that’s not exclusive to one gender as “male-oriented” (especially with the shift where people are trying to get more women into STEM careers). I think masculine is a much better description of what’s included as it’s not as tied to specific gendering, as you have people of either or any gender that can present masculine and/or feminine. Obviously I am more than a billion years late on this one (understatement of the year, and I also wasn’t aware of the working thread’s existence) and can’t change the past, but, this is something to keep in mind for the road ahead if this topic of masculine packs reinforcing gender stereotypes comes up again.
And I’m not really quashing creativity either. I just want more universal inclusivity so it’s more applicable to people who fall outside of that very pigeonholed narrative. I mean, you can make things that do fit that narrative. It does apply to a lot of people’s lives, and I’m not preventing you from doing that. But, in the future, try to be overall inclusive of people who don’t fit that narrative too, as only fitting something to only that narrative reinforces those patriarchal gender stereotypes that are erasure of people like myself. I wish more people understood that pigeonholing a pack is actually also placing a limitation on how may ways it can potentially be used. I suppose ask yourself when designing stuff, if this can be used on more than just one group of people (or if only one group of people is exclusive to whatever thing, which usually isn’t the case), and if more types of people and different ideas can be included in whatever pack is being made. i.e. a pack with tools, can be portrayed with things like “this is the huge process it took to change/fix/modify this thing” or “here’s the big home reno project”, or “look at this awesome thing that someone made”. All 3 of those themes I just threw out as ideas are relevant and not gendered in any way. Not pigeonholing yourself is possible and can be done. I’m not really “offended” so much as desire more representation of people who don’t fit stereotypes, and honestly I think people sell themselves short all the time by directly pandering to stereotypes.
I know Varia and I opened a can of worms with this one. Like her, I’m a very progressive type activist as well. Anyhow I’ll be on the lookout from now on in any of the working threads for blogtrains if something like this issue pops up again. Please don’t be too offended, and my intent was never to “quash creativity” or to “shame” people. I haven’t been on too much because I’ve been up to my eyeballs in work as of late.
Anna, there is a lot of wisdom in your post. I appreciate the time you took to type it out.
Opening cans of worms seems to be one of my specialties, actually.
Kinda goes with the territory for me, because of my faith.
(Don't worry, I'm not getting into that here! ROFL!)
But when something stirs our souls, action is needed.
I don't think the discussion we've had here in the forum has been negative, I'm appreciating it.
I do feel that sometimes we, as human beings, take things too far in the realm of "political correctness".
But bringing a common phrase into focus and making us all think about what we say is always good.
We can all benefit from thinking through things from other vantage points.
(If only I could remember that when I'm tunnel-visioned, about to pop a vein in my neck, pushing my point because "it's the principle of the thing!" as I all too often am caught doing.....)
Thank you everyone for keeping this discussion reasonable. It is easy to be right, but much harder to listen. At DigitalScrapbook.com we are most proud of our community, especially in current times, it gives me great hope that this community was founded on generosity and has proved that to be a sustainable model.
No single designer can represent all worldviews. That's one reason why these blog trains are so wonderful. If you don't see your beliefs or ideas included you may need to represent them yourself. After all, you understand them the best. But it's also important that we remain respectful of designs that may be contrary to our own beliefs.
Hi to Arlene Janner! I'm going to try your Dropbox link another day, as your account has been suspended for too much traffic. Like a lot of others, I don't download from 4 Shared (or Mediafire, for that matter). Have you thought about a free account at another file sharing site? I personally have (paid) accounts at Dropbox, Google Drive and Jumpshare, and you can start off with free accounts at the last two as well. There are other sites, too. Just an idea!
I love your foxes, Sonia!
Julie and Erin, excellent points! I agree wholeheartedly! Thank you for all your hard work, I truly do appreciate it! So far, there hasn't been anything I was offended by in any of the kits. And if there ever would be, I might bring it up in the working thread, or, if I feel that strongly about it, I could just design my OWN kit without the offensive to me items. Absolutely----if there is anything I don't like in anyone's kit, I don't have to download it, or use it! Very simple.
Good point, Lisel "if there is anything I don't like in anyone's kit, I don't have to download it, or use it"
I know that the first thing I do when I've downloaded all the kits is to go through all the folders, and delete items that don't appeal to me personally, or that I know I'll never use. And, it's a great idea to check out the designer previews in the working thread, and raise questions there, rather than in the comments on the final list. I would never question Varia's beliefs (or anyone else's), or their right to raise them on this site, but I do feel that the working thread would be the best place to make a comment, because the item in question could be removed from the kit before the blog train even starts.
Great idea about the working thread Thank you!, I'm still new to PS and right now have limited pc time, but will check it out. For the record I am not and never was "offended" I was never talking about the element in the kit! I was trying to share that the phrase it's self is toxic in the world at large. (why I provided a link) I'm an activist plain and simple, always have been always will be. In my personal life (unlike my profile pic I am 44 years old), I have seen those words "boys will be boys" lead directly to rape. It's a mindset that violence is OK because of a body part and that is wrong to me and many, many others. Thank you to those who are open to people sharing their opinions, this is how we will move forward as a people. We are all one after all. Peace.
Varia, I agree, that phrase has definitely been inappropriately used, and to excuse horrible behavior. It's sad to me that a phrase like this---which used to bring to mind a nostalgic childhood full of muddy knees from playing in the dirt or wrestling with their buddies, ripped jeans from climbing trees, or tinkering with cars or old radios and getting oil all over themselves---is being used to excuse absolutely despicable and abhorrent choices. Hopefully, as we all learn from each other and grow more aware of how things are misused we can bring positive change together.
OH Lisel I do agree, it was such a cute and nostalgic phrase and it is sad!!! Thank you for understanding. I wish your beautiful descriptions were the only thing those words meant.
Susannah, Thank you so much for sharing. I am so sorry that you were assaulted. HUGE gentle hugs. I too love all the communication that came about! YAY!! I continue the peace and health blessings for all in 2017!!
I don't have any hard feelings for people saying what they believe, however, I don't think it' a good idea to for us to start censoring the creative people who have been so kind to make and give away their art. I'm all for people talking about what they would like to see in a blog train, but I don't like the idea of telling someone what their art shouldn't be. I'm very sorry for those who have had bad experiences concerning words and phrases used in the wrong way. I think maybe the time to speak up would be in those particular instances to inform those saying "boys will be boys" to excuse bad behavior is to point out to them that bad behavior has no gender. Take back the true meaning of "boys will be boys" with their muddy knees and dirty faces!
@Anna Johnson: When it comes to word art that isn't really appropriate to me, I look for a way to twist it--maybe a marker font in a contrasting color to make it say "TOMBoys will be TOMboys"... just a thought. I might do a lot of art these days, but I knew the name of every tool in my dad's shop when I was 3 and could go get him an 8" gear puller or a 9/16" box-end offset wrench as long as he was specific about what he wanted. In fact, one of the things I requested for my birthday this year was a Skilsaw, as I have a quick rebuild in mind to recover some floor space in my bedroom/studio and still be able to use the window light...
Wow! What a fun blog-train. I love all of the different takes on the theme. OMG OklahomaDawn, your kit is so cute. I love the banner. You are getting so good at designing. Thank you to all of you. xoxox Beth
Thank you for another fabulous blog train!
I loved this month's blog train! Very different and unique! Loved every single portion! Thank you so much, ladies ❤️
Rene, I loved your suspender and argyle papers!
Great job, everyone
Everything was wonderful! I loved it all! Great job
As a mom of 4 boys, I can see that I will be using this train a lot.
TYVM for this month BT, it's greatfor Father's Day.
I love all the parts of this blog train.Thank you so much for all your hard work.
A big thanks to all the designers for all their hard work and creativity to give so generously.
I would have loved to have known about the working thread when it existed. Also, I’m not shaming designers. This (as in the notion that only men can be masculine tool-users who make things, fix things and so on) is just something I’m kinda tired of seeing in not just one store, and because of my personal life it’s not really represented at all save the few packs that I see around are named things that are non-gender-specific like “nuts and bolts” (which I instantly buy, to the detriment of my bank account. Also: machining blueprints are also something I will instantly purchase too if I see it. I can never get enough of those, hence my singing praises earlier in the thread at Elizabeth? who provided them in the blog train).
An alternate spelling of a title/identity isn’t really the same thing as what I’m describing (as what I’m describing isn’t a tweak but a whole shift on how one perceives culture and society with patriarchal gender norms). I don’t really need to be over-explained on the fact that this is called “the guys”. Last I heard, males didn’t have a monopoly on owning tools, or being the only gender who can use tools. So, it’s really kinda weird for people to describe something that’s not exclusive to one gender as “male-oriented” (especially with the shift where people are trying to get more women into STEM careers). I think masculine is a much better description of what’s included as it’s not as tied to specific gendering, as you have people of either or any gender that can present masculine and/or feminine. Obviously I am more than a billion years late on this one (understatement of the year, and I also wasn’t aware of the working thread’s existence) and can’t change the past, but, this is something to keep in mind for the road ahead if this topic of masculine packs reinforcing gender stereotypes comes up again.
And I’m not really quashing creativity either. I just want more universal inclusivity so it’s more applicable to people who fall outside of that very pigeonholed narrative. I mean, you can make things that do fit that narrative. It does apply to a lot of people’s lives, and I’m not preventing you from doing that. But, in the future, try to be overall inclusive of people who don’t fit that narrative too, as only fitting something to only that narrative reinforces those patriarchal gender stereotypes that are erasure of people like myself. I wish more people understood that pigeonholing a pack is actually also placing a limitation on how may ways it can potentially be used. I suppose ask yourself when designing stuff, if this can be used on more than just one group of people (or if only one group of people is exclusive to whatever thing, which usually isn’t the case), and if more types of people and different ideas can be included in whatever pack is being made. i.e. a pack with tools, can be portrayed with things like “this is the huge process it took to change/fix/modify this thing” or “here’s the big home reno project”, or “look at this awesome thing that someone made”. All 3 of those themes I just threw out as ideas are relevant and not gendered in any way. Not pigeonholing yourself is possible and can be done. I’m not really “offended” so much as desire more representation of people who don’t fit stereotypes, and honestly I think people sell themselves short all the time by directly pandering to stereotypes.
I know Varia and I opened a can of worms with this one. Like her, I’m a very progressive type activist as well. Anyhow I’ll be on the lookout from now on in any of the working threads for blogtrains if something like this issue pops up again. Please don’t be too offended, and my intent was never to “quash creativity” or to “shame” people. I haven’t been on too much because I’ve been up to my eyeballs in work as of late.
Anna, there is a lot of wisdom in your post. I appreciate the time you took to type it out.
Opening cans of worms seems to be one of my specialties, actually.
Kinda goes with the territory for me, because of my faith.
(Don't worry, I'm not getting into that here! ROFL!)
But when something stirs our souls, action is needed.
I don't think the discussion we've had here in the forum has been negative, I'm appreciating it.
I do feel that sometimes we, as human beings, take things too far in the realm of "political correctness".
But bringing a common phrase into focus and making us all think about what we say is always good.
We can all benefit from thinking through things from other vantage points.
(If only I could remember that when I'm tunnel-visioned, about to pop a vein in my neck, pushing my point because "it's the principle of the thing!" as I all too often am caught doing.....)
Thank you everyone for keeping this discussion reasonable. It is easy to be right, but much harder to listen. At DigitalScrapbook.com we are most proud of our community, especially in current times, it gives me great hope that this community was founded on generosity and has proved that to be a sustainable model.
No single designer can represent all worldviews. That's one reason why these blog trains are so wonderful. If you don't see your beliefs or ideas included you may need to represent them yourself. After all, you understand them the best. But it's also important that we remain respectful of designs that may be contrary to our own beliefs.
Thanks again everyone
^^^^ What she said.
What a controversy! Great job every body
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